Escape from TiVo

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Escape from TiVo

Fazal Majid, an experienced entrepreneur, businessman, and technologist I respect, writes about how he has given up his Tivo for a Panasonic DVR, mainly because he has lost trust in the company.

...the main reason for the upgrade was the fact I have for some time lost any vestigial trust for TiVo (the company). They spam you with advertising in the user interface (one of the items in the PVR main menu is a rotating ad), expropriate a portion of your precious hard drive space for the said spam, track your usage patterns behind your back, and have a nasty habit of disabling features in software releases.

Fazal Majid's low-intensity weblog: Escape from TiVo

by Gen Kanai December 1, 2003 in TiVo

Comments

No program guide? No thanks. Anyway, I think he's complaining about the wrong things--I want to know why there aren't more improvements in Season Pass, Suggests and the cable box interface.

Posted by: BillSaysThis at Dec 1, 2003 6:31:51 PM

The advertising has always been part of their business model - and if one item in the menu really bugs you, you need to get a life. They aren't auto-playing the ads or anything, and frankly I rather like some of it - like the BMW Films, some of the music previews promoing CDs, etc. Anything I don't like, I don't watch - simple.

And the HD space is reserved for TiVo's use anyway. It was never advertised or promised to you, it has zero impact on the product as purchased. So that's a bullshit complaint.

As for the data tracking - did he miss the fact that you can opt-out of that easily? I guess he'd rather complain than read the docs.

As for the last complaint - what? I must be forgetting something, what feature have they disabled? The only one I can think of, and it is reaching, is 30 second skip, which was off in 2.0, but back in 2.5. And that isn't an official feature.

Posted by: MegaZone at Dec 1, 2003 7:18:56 PM

I gave up Tivo because of its lame program extraction policy. While I miss the superior Tivo interface, I'm much more satisfied being able to watch programs on my notebook (which, btw, is a major, major non-feature that Tivo has now made impossible in Series 2).

Posted by: pb at Dec 1, 2003 9:47:31 PM

I agree with MegaZone; these are all the same complaints that gripers have been making since the beginning of time, and eventually it became obvious that they just like complaining, because they have no response to these obvious answers.

The tracking is not only opt-out-able, but they don't track your personal info with what you're watching! Why would anyone care that TiVo knows what someone in your zip code is watching? I understand wanting to protect your privacy, but come on.

As far as extraction goes; it would be nice, but given the history of ReplayTv and how it's miraculous that they are still operating, I would rather have TiVo stay in business than give me everything I want.

Posted by: rob at Dec 2, 2003 12:00:24 PM

I am the writer of the original comment. The disabling of functionality I was referring to is the fact that a TiVo without a subscription is pretty much a doorstop now, whereas with V 1.0 it was somewhat usable (not as much as TiVo Basic, but still).

I didn't buy the lifetime subscription with my unit, because it is not transferrable and I originally expected to upgrade within a year to a model with dual tuners and more HD capacity. At some point, I just decided I did not want to pay TiVo any more.

I take some issue with people who don't know me qualifying me as a whiner. A whiner would keep his TiVo and keep on ranting. I rant, but I also voted with my feet (and dollars). The SVR-2000 will be going to eBay this week-end.

Posted by: Fazal Majid at Dec 3, 2003 2:19:56 PM

pb - actually you can extract from a Series2, they've been fairly well hacked now. See DealDatabase.com for S2 hacks.

Posted by: MegaZone at Dec 7, 2003 1:03:51 AM

I just called DirecTV, selected the technical support option, and told them that I wanted to opt-out of any data collection from my DirecTV/TiVo box. The representative put me on hold twice to talk with someone who might know what I was talking about. He transferred me to a "specialty group that deals with privacy issues." When they came on the line, they announced themselves as "expanded support." I explained that I didn't want my viewing habits to be uploaded at all--and the representative indicated that she didn't know what I was talking about and declared that no information is ever uploaded, only downloaded. I insisted she check, got put on hold, and then got the same answer. I told her to look at the TiVo site directly. She told me to call TiVo.

I called TiVo. "The expected delay time will be more than 20 minutes" message I heard was not a good way omen. "By the way, if you have DirecTV integrated with your TiVo unit, you'll need to call DirecTV" said the automated attendant. I got transferred to a live operator--who said the same thing and suggested I call DirecTV and gave me the number 800.793.4102 (Expanded Support).

I called DirecTV again. Again, they didn't know that the DirecTV/TiVo unit collected info. They looked up some info and then declared that "no personally identifiable information" is collected--and they finally acknowledged that at least stripped information is collected. They then said that there is no way to opt-out. They also said that unplugging the phone line will eventually result in the TiVo subscription to be cancelled. I then told them that I wished to file a complaint with the FCC Consumer Affairs (I asked them nicely), so I asked for a name that I could use in the letter. Instead, they told me that they'd transfer me to "2nd Level Escalation Support."

I finally found someone who knew. They told me they'd change my privacy selection and it would be effective after 72 hours. The request must be done for each DirecTV/TiVo unit that is owned. I asked if the TiVo unit would display any info confirming that the change was, in fact, made. They said, "no" but to call back to check if I liked. I asked if they would put this information on the directv.com website. They said that it is there, even if it is buried in a PDF document and not in any of the FAQs, nor findable by any link that talks about opting out of annonymous data collection. The PDF file is:

http://www.directv.com/learn/pdf/dt...ypolicy_eng.pdf

and says in section IV, "Even though Anonymous Viewing Information does not include any Account Information whatsoever, you may request that we block the collection of such information from your DIRECTV receiver. You may further opt not to receive communications that we send to you based on your Account Information. If you make this choice, you understand that we will not be able to inform you about any upcoming features, improvements, or promotions regarding your DIRECTV service."

Lastly, Section VI says, "We may, from time to time, contact you by mail, e-mail or telephone to tell you about additional products or services that we or third parties may offer. If you do not wish to receive such calls or promotional materials, contact us by ...."

This exercise took over 1.5 hours. Here's the shortcut:

How to Opt Out

1. Call the 2nd Level Escalation Support number: 800.695.9251 and ask to talk with someone in the "DVR Specialty Group."
2. Ask to have your privacy status changed and specifically mention that you do not wish your viewing habit data to be uploaded or used, even if personally identifiable viewing information has been removed. (Section IV)
3. Ask to not receive communications that are sent based on your Account Information. (Section IV)
4. Ask to have your mail, e-mail, and phone not be used by DirecTV or third parties concerning additional products or other promotional calls. (Section VI)
5. Call back in 72 hours to confirm your status has been changed if you like.

Most representatives (even 2nd Level) don't know this is possible; just reference the quote from the PDF file above and insist they abide by their published privacy policies.

I hope this helps save some time for those that feel that even anonymous data collection is unwanted and wish to terminate it.

Posted by: Tom at May 11, 2005 8:13:37 AM

I was at my 3rd Tivo box and finally a year or so after the last replacement it broke again. They wanted to charge me 149$ for replacement. I will no way pay for a box that will break after a year again. I canceled my subscription and I will get a DVR from my cable company.

Posted by: Emre Aydinceren at Jan 7, 2007 6:18:25 PM

Escape from TiVo

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